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I bet I’m going to regret posting this, but I’m not sure where else to turn with this. If you don’t want to hear a middle aged woman talk about sex, just back out now.

My husband and I were together for 20+ years prior to his affair. We had ups and downs in our sex life—I’m a CSA survivor, we both came out of ultra conservative religious communities with problematic approaches to sex, and we had the normal ups and downs with babies, small kids, life stress, etc. He’s always had a somewhat stronger drive and more appetite for experimentation than me, but over the years we were consistent with frequency, our bodies have always worked well together, and our norm was regular good sex interspersed with occasions of spectacular sex.

After d-day we were in hard core hysterical bonding mode for close to nine months, with a generous side of sexual pick-me dancing from me that I wasn’t even fully cognizant of.

One night, in the middle of sex, wearing something more risqué than I tend to be comfortable with and that he didn’t really notice as something new and out there for me, something in me snapped. I felt broken and disgusted with myself. It was a healthy realization for me. I wanted my husband, I wanted our relationship, I wanted to reconcile, and I wanted a sex life with him, but I was done performing.

Our sex life since then has been regular, but pretty vanilla and lacking the pre-affair experimentation and fireworks. It’s been complicated by our recovery process, and over the last year a lot of the physical changes that come with nearing 50 have complicated things further and made me even less inclined to be fun and free and experimental. We still have sex regularly (I do have a sex drive), but it’s cut and dried. This has hit my husband pretty hard. He feels like I’m hiding my body from him, having sex only on my terms, and not compromising and trying to build a good faith sexual relationship between partners. He’s not wrong, but somehow I just don’t have it in me. Having basic sex feels natural and good, but i have this huge block in my head about doing anything performative (even wearing basic lingerie) or experimental/adventurous. The thought of it makes me feel sick and distressed and sad, to be honest.

At this point I don’t know what is affair related or just marriage and stage of life related, but it’s at least somewhat about the change in my head and heart with the betrayal. I feel like the sex life we had before was built on the trust I had in him. I don’t have that trust anymore, which is actually healthier and I feel good about the level of trust I have in him and the relationship. But it’s not a level that seems to allow for sexual vulnerability on my part.

Thoughts? Empathy? Advice? I’m sequestered in my room with Covid over Christmas and it’s giving me too much time to think.

I never realised how much a sex life can change after an affair! I’m not sure it’s talked about much really other than the hysterical bonding.

I’m just under a year and a half out from D-Day and our sex life is still amazing BUT I haven’t made love to my husband since D-Day and I don’t think I ever will. We have spoken about this at great lengths and as hard as it is to accept I now only ‘fuck’ my husband.

When we are done we are done. I don’t allow any closeness. It’s sad but I just can’t put any ‘emotions’ into this part of our married life.

I am experiencing almost exactly the same process and timing. We had hysterical bonding for the first year. Lots of ups and downs but when I think about it I did the same thing you did some sort of subconscious pick me dance. At about the year point I really fully realized this was not about me or our past sex life, which was actually very good and very frequent. I also found out about more affairs. At that point something majorly shifted in me. Sex became more triggering and was completely just physical for me.
I also don’t feel any sort of emotional closeness or feel adventurous in any way. We’re at almost 3 years from d day. I have a hard time even kissing. I really miss our old sex life and relationship but it’s like you said I don’t have that vulnerability that I did. I don’t know that I will. My WH has been extremely patient and is just happy with whatever. I think I’m more dissatisfied than he may be. Anyway just wanted to say that I understand what you are feeling. Big hugs to you, I feel like there are so many layers to betrayal and it has affected me in every possible way.

Thank you Webbit and Salt. My husband has also been patient and hasn’t made this an issue, but we both know it is one. There are definitely times when sex is loving, but the post affair norm is mostly basic and physical, not emotional or exciting. Emotionally I feel like I’m moving beyond the plain of lethal flatness, but maybe sexually that’s still where I am? I don’t know.

Emotionally I feel like I’m moving beyond the plain of lethal flatness, but maybe sexually that’s still where I am?

I think that's a very real possibility.

Is your CSA interfering with your desire? I don't have words to say more, except that CSA isn't your fault. It's a terrible, difficult burden to carry.

Hiding your body? Does 50 bother you? My W & I have been together 59+ years, and she looked better on 1965 than she does now. I did, too. She looked better 30 years ago than she does today; me, too. We can't build long term relationships without getting older, and we deteriorate physically as we age. I still harbor within me the 21 year old who fell in love with W2b, and that 21 year old thinks that 30 is too old for sex. But I know the 21 year old has a lot to learn - and other ego states in me have learned it.

The only antidote I can come up with is to accept yourself and feel the joy of doing so. And really take note of THIS: you may not be happy about getting to 50, but your H still desires you, and you still desire him. The clock has a lot of uses, but the mind and body know those uses are limited.

There's nothing new you might want to try? Nothing?

If not, then as a rather vanilla option... you can make animal noises. Both you and him.

He takes his boxers off and an elephant call comes from no where... kinda sets the playful mood a bit.

Thank you, not the victim, for making me laugh.

And thank you as always, Sisoon, for your wisdom.

I don’t think the CSA impacts my baseline sexual desire. But it’s a complicating factor. Before my husband’s betrayal I honestly didn’t think much about it. It was something that impacted me and our sexual relationship in our early years together, but I honestly felt like it was something I had faced and accepted and moved on from. It almost never came to mind, and when it did, it didn’t feel particularly traumatic. But man, it hit me like an effing freight train after d-day. And I sense that it’s a factor in me feeling incapable of the kind of vulnerability that improving our sex life would require.

In isolation, I don’t care that much about aging. My self worth hasn’t ever been that tied up in what I look like, and in a lot of ways I like my upper 40s more than lots of other stages of life so far. One of the epiphanies I had when thinking through boundaries in the wake of my husband’s affair is that I have very solid boundaries, not because I’m a saint, but because romantic/sexual attention from men has always sparked caution and fright in me (probably CSA related).

I think the hiding isn’t because I’m ashamed of my body (I have a better relationship and view of my body at 47 than I did 25 years ago, when by conventional standards I was pretty hot). It’s the vulnerability piece of not actually wanting someone else to see it, especially someone who didn’t value my hard-earned sexual vulnerability enough not to destroy it. And at this stage I have less than zero desire to try to achieve that vulnerability with anyone else. If our marriage dissolves I have no interest in forging a relationship with anyone else.

It’s a lot simpler for my husband. He’s deeply remorseful and wants an open, free, exciting sexual relationship. I don’t think it’s possible for him to understand why it’s so complicated and painful for me, even when I try to explain and he tries to understand. I’m a tangled up mess in this area, and he doesn’t get it.

And it scares me, to be honest. I don’t think many men in their 40s in our polyamory-infatuated, porn-saturated day and age are willing or happy to stare down bland monogamy for the rest of their lives. In my lowest moments I feel like I can never be a satisfactory partner and that he’s going to leave or want to leave at some point. I talk myself down from my bleakest thoughts, because I know they’re not helpful or representative of where we are overall, but it’s also difficult to gin up real hope.

I don’t think many men in their 40s in our polyamory-infatuated, porn-saturated day and age are willing or happy to stare down bland monogamy for the rest of their lives. In my lowest moments I feel like I can never be a satisfactory partner and that he’s going to leave or want to leave at some point.

But you don't have to deal with many men right now - you just have to determine if he's giving you what you want and whether or not your H wants monogamy with you. I feared my W would leave for 3.5-4 years after d-day. At that point, I decided she really did want R. She doubted my commitment for longer than that. She finally realized I controlled whether I stayed or not, and she decided to take the evidence at face value - I was still with her, I said I wanted to be with her, and she decided to to accept the evidence.

As for being free in sex ... IDK ... my W wasn't as free as I wanted, but she was a free as she could be, given the impact of CSA on her. That was enough for me, and I can imagine it could be enough for your H. Sex is a giant part of love, but it isn't transactional.

You've got to be honest with yourself - does he express love and satisfaction in ways you want? Do you believe him when he does? That's what counts IMO; if you make a mistake here, you'll hurt, but you'll recover - you're smart and strong and probably still hot.

BTW, after menopause, my W's sex drive intensified significantly. Just sayin'.... In some ways, our timing has been ...um... sub-optimal. Of course, Viagra/Cialis/etc. weren't available yet when I hit 50....

[This message edited by SI Staff at 8:07 PM, Wednesday, December 25th]

Sisoon, I hope you know what a gift you are to this community and to people like me.

You’re exactly right; everything you said. I mostly believe his commitment; he’s not wavered in it and the last 4.5 years have not been a walk in the park. But whatever part of my psyche that is linked to feeling sexually comfortable with him hasn’t fully registered that belief.

Thank you for your insight. It helps.

I relate to this on many levels. I too am approaching 50. (Though as sisoon reported with his wife her libido went up, mine did as well but not at first)

However I don’t think it’s about libido. It’s about emotional intimacy. We have been on a journey as well and I learned that because I was more doing pick me things I felt like I didn’t know what was authentic for me sexually. That is greatly inhibiting. We had the old reliable stuff that always worked too, and I would gravitate towards that for sure.

We spent a lot of time slowing everything down. We would touch and kiss until I felt ready to move on. The slowing down helped me connect to my desire and also that slow burn increased my arousal so in later stages I wasn’t in my head at all. After some time has passed we learned that the slow down is good for both of us. No more performance anxiety from me made my arousal come more quickly. In that state, I have learned that I am a very sensual person who had followed my husband’s lead far too long. His approach to sex had been conditioned by porn.

So it allowed him to learn to connect to me better as well, and he has learned when he takes his time my passion can be off the charts. For a little while he also had to turn to viagra because it is wasn’t his picture of what was hot. Now we are cooking in all four burners again, this has all been very recent and we also are at 4 years and a few months past his dday.

Slow down so you can learn what you like. But it can be a frustrating process at times. But when you both show up authentically the emotional connection is amazing.

We also worked on emotional intimacy outside the bedroom during this "reset" and found our deeper communication now leads us into sex naturally. Spend time in safe experimentation at first- caressing, massage, nibbling, holding each other, slow kissing that naturally builds. Teasing, changing pace, pressure, etc.

Now I look forward to it, miss it if we go more days than normal. I now know what to ask for, and I have been surprised the difference it makes. It’s like we have unlocked a level of sex we hadn’t experienced before.

[This message edited by hikingout at 5:57 PM, Thursday, December 26th]

Hiking out, that’s so helpful. I’m overwhelmed with gratitude for the quality of responses to this thread. HO, i can relate to almost everything you said. I think there’s a little bit more of a convoluted mess in my mind about this due to CSA and some other stuff feeding into my situation, but what you’re saying gives me a way to think about a practical path forward. Thank you.

Grieving, I so get what you are dealing with. My wife and I haven’t "made love" in quite a number of years. We have sex but we still don’t have that new bond/connection. If I desire sex then I’m all for it but at the end of the day, that’s all it really is, sex. She really has some mental blocks on truly opening up to her emotional feelings and that is what I’ve needed from her since DDay almost 4 years ago. I continually give her the opportunity to work on herself while I slowly make preparations to move on in life to be happy. Where the X and Y axis’s of this relationship cross is yet TBD. I do love the sex, but I don’t really desire her from a standpoint of being "in love". She desires sex more than I do, but that’s where her needs lie, mine lie more in the emotional/connection realm. Will we ever bridge that plane, who knows. I can tell you that I don’t stress over whichever path we wind up going down. I’ve forgiven her for her indiscretions so that I could forgive myself, and I’ve made peace with myself for whichever decision I end up making. It feels good to believe in yourself and to have clarity in what we want and to move toward that goal. I wish you peace in this new year.

I don’t think many men in their 40s in our polyamory-infatuated, porn-saturated day and age are willing or happy to stare down bland monogamy for the rest of their lives.

Things ebb and flow. We’ve been all over the place in our decades.

For reasons that escape me, and probably my wife too, right now we are having "boring, bland" sex…daily. In the morning. No spicy lingerie or play acting, no exploring the infinite multitude of possible positions, just good old fashioned sex. Instead of trying to experience every kind of experience, it’s more like trying to execute the same perfect skiing turn, or flip a pancake, or some other single thing you can explore the depths of. It’s become meditative. Groundhog Day sex. Hard to explain, and I’m not complaining. Went through a period of wanting to broaden some horizons, but wife is not interested in that. Just this. Well, OK then. 🙂

I hope your husband comes around and accepts it.

Thank you coping and house of plane. Everyone’s responses have really helped me. Coping, I’m really sorry that you haven’t gotten that emotional connection. I think in my case, it’s me who still has a way to go in building that. It’s a long slow journey to heal myself from the emotional destruction of my husband’s infidelity and to repair the old/create a new bond between us. House, I think there’s a lot to be said for the type and frequency of the sex you describe. To me it sounds like a river that flows steadily, deepening its course over time.

W and I touch on the topic below every NYE/day. We've taken a long time to get where we are. I've written this post in the hope that a reader can use my experience to connect with their partner a lot quicker than we've been able to. Slow and steady is fine. Faster is better.

New Year's is a big deal for us. I drafted a paragraph to explain why, but that's irrelevant. What's relevant is that we talk about our relationship's history this time of year. We remember how our personal dysfunctions interfered in big ways at first. It's taken a long time to name the problems, and in the recent past we've been able to name The Problem - low self-esteem.

Low self-esteem brought on fear, and that fear kept us from connecting as deeply as we wanted. Fear of rejection slowed us down.

Grieving,

Your H married you. You married him despite CSA. At some deep level, you accepted each other. Your H cheated - but I strongly suspect that was rejection of himself, not rejection of you.

Consider taking the giant risk of dealing with how low self-esteem has been an obstacle. The downside is that if you do that you might find you and your H are too far apart to reconnect. The upside is that you may find you're more already deeply and more pleasurably connected than you ever thought possible.

Note, though: I urge you to consider taking the risk. The decision is yours. WRT my suggestion, accept it, reject it, twist it around any way you like to make it serve your best interests.

I'll say this, though: the less one lets low self-esteem obstruct them, the better for you and the people around you.

This post may belong in InkHulk's thread on how not to get stuck.

*****

The A plays a very small part of our talk. It was, after all, and artifact my W's low self-esteem problem.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 8:27 PM, Wednesday, January 1st]

I would actually love to see the paragraph you drafted about why New Year’s Day is important to you and your wife, Sisoon.

The part of your post that resonated the most with me is where you pointed out that we married each other and accepted each other on a deep level. That feels true to me, and like something to lean into and explore. The acceptance piece hit a little bit of a nerve, because when I think about it, I’m not sure if my husband accepts this messier, more sexually and romantically reserved post affair version of me. Which on one level I understand and respect—he’s a kind, thoughtful, patient person on the whole, and he’s trying to be honest about what he wants and needs and is willing to put significant work into building a mutually satisfying relationship. On another level, though, it feels like a profound rejection.

I don’t know how to think about the self esteem piece. I honestly think my self esteem has improved a lot through the healing process. I like and accept myself more than I ever did before, and even at my lowest points I have a well of self confidence and peace about unknown outcomes that I never had before.

I don’t think my husband’s affair was rooted in low self esteem, though I think he’s struggled with that in the aftermath because of guilt and shame and how it impacted his sense of who he is as a person. Oddly I think him expressing discontent with where we are is a sign of some of that toxic shame dissipating and his self esteem improving to the point that he can start thinking about and advocating for what he wants.

But that raises the question of whether this version of me is what he wants. And that triggers some pretty messy rejection issues for me.

What is missing for you?

What is sex for you? (For me it's simultaneous connection, pleasure, giving, taking, dominance, submission.)

Are you withholding out of fear or because you're wanting more confirmation that he's not betraying you or because?

I don’t know how to think about the self esteem piece. I honestly think my self esteem has improved a lot through the healing process. I like and accept myself more than I ever did before, and even at my lowest points I have a well of self confidence and peace about unknown outcomes that I never had before.

High self-esteem is entirely appropriate. Your healing is working, IMO.

The downside of high self-esteem is that it leads to looking more deeply inside to find more problems to solve.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 11:50 PM, Thursday, January 2nd]

Do you think this is because of peri/menopausal issues ? I am in the same age group as yours and it’s done a number on me physically and mentally.
One another note, highly recommend that both of you should read "Come as you are " by Emily Nagoski .

Having sex on your terms is informed consent. If it isn't on the terms, I think that qualifies as sexual assault. I'm also a CSA and was raped by my XWH two times that he will admit.

Have you thought about seeing a sex therapist? They may be able to help you navigate the child abuse and infidelity (and other issues) to work through this? It may be something to consider.

I would like to offer heartfelt empathy! I was juuuust getting ready to post a "4 plus years out musings) myself and your headline caught my eye.

I completely and totally understand how you feel and feel very similar myself.

The way it hit me, when I reached this phase, was I was done "auditioning to be his wife."

That is really how it felt. I am 4. 5 years out from learning the truth and making the decision (some of it circumstance) to reconcile or at least try.
Sex will never be the same for me. It just won't. With anyone. At my age, with the baggage I had from a million other things, I feel very peaceful about that.

I applaud you knowing who you are in this department. It may sadden him (or whatever the word) but the ones that cheated on us have to understand that their actions put this intimacy category in a terrible spot. However any of us authentically choose to proceed is important to us. And right now, that really matters.